Interview with Award-Winning Actor, Director & Author,
Lou Diamond Phillips
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Lou Diamond Phillips Interview Notes
In this episode of Eat My Globe, our host, Simon Majumdar, welcomes back actor, director, writer and theatrical performer, Lou Diamond Phillips to the podcast. They will be talking about Lou’s superb best-selling new book, “The Tinderbox: Underground Movement”; his upcoming theatrical, movie and TV work; and his favorite food scenes from non-food related movies. They will also talk about Lou’s favorite recipes, and his passion for cooking. You do not want to miss this episode.
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Transcript
Eat My Globe
Interview with Award-Winning Actor, Director & Author,
Lou Diamond Phillips
INTRO MUSIC
Simon Majumdar (“SM”):
Hi everybody. Welcome to a new episode of Eat My Globe, a podcast about things you didn't know you didn't know about food. And while this episode is a new one, our guest is someone we have had on before. And because that episode with this guest is such a favourite, we thought we'd have him on again. Now, this week's guest is an award-winning actor, a magnificent director and writer. He has worked in the theatre, television and films. He has had a very long body of work, so it's hard to pick a favourite. But his fairly recent work and varied work in the TV show, “Prodigal Son,” the animated show, “Trese,” and the variety show, “The Masked Singer,” have been very enjoyable indeed. He is very much an actor's actor. But he has now added to his long list of achievements his debut novel, “Tinderbox Soldier of Indira,” is a bestseller. And recently he has written the second installment of his Tinderbox series, “The Tinderbox: Underground Movement,” which is, as everything he does, fantastic.
Ladies and gentlemen, our good friend, the one and only Mr. Lou Diamond Phillips. I'm so happy that you're here. Hi, Lou.
Lou Diamond Phillips (“LDP”):
Hello, hello, Mr. Majumder, my dear friend, or as we call you, and as Guy Fieri calls you in this household, Scoop!
[Laughter]
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
My daughter, my daughter Indigo, is a huge, huge fan of yours, my friend.
SM:
Oh, that's so fantastic. Oh. It's just great to have you back. I'm not gonna lie, today isn't about history. It's not about anything. We just wanted you on here because you're so much fun when we have you on. But we've got a few history questions later on. But before we move to. . . .
LDP:
Absolutely.
SM:
Yeah. Before we move on to those let's talk about your new. . . Let's talk about, you know, what you're doing in TV, movies that because you've got so much going on and whenever I read them, apart from you always saying thank you to anyone who wishes you a happy birthday or you're wishing them happy birthday and all of that, which is great on Twitter, you always are coming out with new shows or new films and. . . . So please tell us about that. And then we want to talk about this very special book.
LDP:
It's so funny because you can do so much over a year and then all of sudden everything just seems to come out at once. And it looks like you're just all over the place. . .
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
. . . when it's taken you a year, a year and a half to amass this amount of credits, you know. Recently for the gamers out there, “Call of Duty” just dropped and I am finally a character in the “Call of. . .” They captured my likeness and everything.
SM:
Oh wow.
LDP:
Although I have to say, yeah, they put a full beard on me. I can't grow a full beard, man. You know, I’m. . .
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
. . . part Filipino.
[Laughter]
I look like Ben Affleck in Argo.
[Laughter]
So yes, I'm a character in that. I have a movie that's going to be streaming and in select theaters soon that I made in Canada with some really, really exciting young filmmakers called, “Get Fast.”
SM:
Okay.
LDP:
On December 6th, I have a movie that is definitely in theaters nationwide and, you know, all North America with Frank Grillo, a big action star. People love him.
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
Myself and Katrina Law called, “Werewolves.” Guess what it's about.
[Laughter]
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
And that's in theaters December 6th. And then sometime next year, I don't know when, because we haven't started shooting, I will be in an HBO comedy called, “The Chair Company.” So really, really excited to get back to some comedy. I always have such a good time with that.
SM:
Yeah, you and that's the thing about you. You seem to move between the drama and action and comedy. And I, I love. . . Do you. . . . And the reason, just so people can't. . . will understand how we met was because you're on the Food Network going with the late great Coolio. I still remember this and I remember watching it one time well one I watched the whole series, but I remember watching the final and you make you redoing the soup and I always remember what the tomato broth or whatever it was and. . .
LDP:
Yes.
SM:
. . . And that's how you. . . and I remember thinking that guy knows what he's doing. I knew of you, of course, but that's. . . .
LDP:
Well, that means a lot to me. You know how important cooking is to me. I really, I'm gonna put this out in the universe again. I wanna get back on a cooking show. To compete, to judge, whatever. I love that world. And as you know, I'm a co-owner of Tribeca Grill in New York City, which has been going strong since 1990.
SM:
Yeah, it's a great, great restaurant.
LDP:
And I often pop into there. I often do charity events there.
SM:
Oh, maybe we could do. . . .
LDP:
Yeah, no, it's a great place. But the thing about that, and I'm so glad you noticed that, is that in that final competition, the sous chef had gotten the portions wrong, you know. It was a chip, you know, and it was the chip in a broth. And I like doing a little something different with my broth. And when I tasted it, went, my, it's not right. It was a massive pot of it because we had to feed like 50 people. And I thought, oh my God, do I toss all of this out?
And do I have enough time for the white wine to reduce and not taste like turpentine? You know, so, so. . .
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
. . . I was faced with that dilemma. And as you know, I, I decided to redo it and pray that it reduced down in time.
SM:
I always remember that. Hopefully, I did an event earlier this week for Oligo Nation, which is something that I have. It's a brain cancer. And they came down and we did a dish at Scopa. And it was an amazing thing. We had lots and lots of. . . . We had Duff and Antonia, Mei Lin, Brooke, and they were doing this. And we're now going to hopefully do one in New York. So maybe we could tie together and do something.
LDP:
Call me.
SM:
If we could do that with them, that would be fantastic.
LDP:
I'm in, I'm in, I'm in, I'm in. Call me, if I'm in town, I'm there.
SM:
Fantastic. Okay. Fantastic. Thank you.
LDP:
And I would love to cook alongside you. You and I talked about this forever. Me, you and Sybil, it's like, man, let's get in the kitchen somewhere.
SM:
That would be fantastic. We’d. . . Oh, I'd love to do that. Let's. . . . Before we do that and before we go on, let's. . . tell me about your writing because your writing has become very important to you. I know it has. And, you know, part of me kind of thinks, well, is he doing that because it'll give him a role on. . . it'll be on TV or it'll be. . . and that's kind of what I'm thinking. But as well, once I read this book and I'm holding it up here again, “Tinderbox,” and we'll talk about this in a moment, but this is very serious. It's very well, very well written. And I'm, you know, I've worked in publishing for a long, long time for Penguin and for Orion and for all other publishers. And this is a very well written book. So, you're not just doing it to give yourself a role on TV or anywhere.
So, tell us about this Tinderbox series because it's great just what I've read here but I'm waiting for the new series to get the first book.
LDP:
Fortunately, it was standalone. There was a few spoilers in the second one that'll go back to the first one. But the stories both, you know, can exist on their own. But, you know, I think once you've read the first one, you might want to go back and refer to the second one because there's some interesting context there.
I wanted to be. . . It's funny, my dad, who's from North Carolina and then in Texas, talks like this.
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
When I was about 13, he said, son, what would you like to do for a living? And at the time I said, dad, I want to be a writer. He goes, well, I was thinking about, you know, something where maybe you could make some more money.
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
[Laughter]
You know, and so a year later I came back and went, dad, I want to be an actor. He goes, that's not what I had in mind.
SM:
[Laughter]
LDP:
[Laughter]
So, I ended up majoring in theater in college, but I had an honors English minor. And I did a lot of writing throughout college, mostly plays, but some narrative.
And, and, so, I've written plays, I've written a number of screenplays. So when I got to Hollywood, you know, I just expanded in the screenplays. I’ve had a few produced. And then when my wife, Yvonne and I, speaking of wives, when we met, we were looking at each other’s other outside not famous work. She was a makeup and hair artist, which is how we met. I discovered she is an amazing, amazing illustrator, an unbelievable artist. And at the time. . . .
SM:
I know, this is phenomenal.
LDP:
Yes. And she did the cover of that. She has all of the illustrations inside. She's got like 30 illustrations in the first book, but done in a different style, more of a pen and ink kind of German woodcut kind of feel, which is what she grew up with. But when we first met, I saw some frames that she had done for a graphic novel. And it was inspired by Hans Christian Andersen's “The Tinder Box.” And I looked at her and I said, this looks like a movie.
SM:
I'm trying to just find. . . .
LDP:
You know, and it had this sort of Asian influence that Star Wars had. So, I wrote a screenplay. She said, yeah, go ahead and write it. I wrote a screenplay, realized that it was so damn expensive. Nobody would ever give me the money to direct it. And it was my manager who said, well, write the novel then. And so, over a period of 10 years, I have to say it was 10 years, because, you know, my day job kept getting in the way.
SM:
Wow. Yeah, of course.
LDP:
Off and on, I wrote the “Tinderbox: Soldier of Indira.” And I owe a huge debt of thanks to Fred Johnson, who wrote the Longmire series, the books. . .
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
. . . that the TV show is based on. I showed him a couple of chapters and I said, am I wasting my time? And he goes, no, you got to finish this. And then when it was finished, another dear friend, Chris Bohjalian, a New York Times bestselling author of “The Flight Attendant,” and many, many others. . .
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
. . . read it, loved it, and passed it on to his agent. And that is how I eventually got it published.
SM:
Wow.
LDP:
So, the first book did so well, was, was so critically well received and sold so well that we thought, okay, well, let's do the sequel. And we thought that we would invade the fairy tale realm once again. But then all of a sudden out of the blue, my wife comes up with this idea. Yvonne says, well, what about this? And it's as if she pulled the plot from between the lines of the first book. And I can say that the first book is very much a fairy tale. Follows the plot of the Hans Christian Andersen fairy tale.
SM:
Yep.
LDP:
The second book, as you now know, is a little bit more of a mystery political thriller and obviously influenced by what's going on in the world right now and. . .
SM:
Yes.
LDP:
. . . with a definite sort of environmental angle as well.
SM:
Oh. I loved it and I started reading, you know, and I started reading, you know, throughout just to get, you know, the feeling for it. And I will say now. So that's called “Tinderbox: Underground Movement.”
LDP:
And it's fun, know, mean, Underground Movement is a play on words. And Yvonne did that illustration of a new character who's not in the first book, but in the second, called Hester. And we both agree that we very much wanted it to be evocative of the little girl on the “Les Miserables,” you know, poster.
SM:
Oh.
LDP:
You know, because it is, is it the resistance? Is it an underground movement? Is it that sort of thing? And so it has echoes of that.
SM:
Oh. I love “Les Miserables.” I remember seeing it when it first came out in London. And it was just, it was, it was always, and now people are going, you know, because they've seen it all and they've seen the movie and they've done everything. But they don't realize just how good that was when it first came out. And before anyone had seen anything like that. It was an amazing movie.
LDP:
Anything like it.
SM:
Amazing theatre production. It really was. I think London was the first apart from...
LDP:
Yeah, I believe so. I believe so. Andrew Lloyd Webber, yes?
SM:
Yeah, have you ever, have you ever played. . . Yeah, have you ever, done theater in London? He says asking another question.
LDP:
I have not, and I would crawl through broken glass to do that. The opportunity has never come up. I live in New York now, so I'm dying to get back on stage here.
SM:
Of course.
LDP:
I recently went back to Texas to Casa Manana in Fort Worth last summer, and I did “Miss Saigon” on stage. . .
SM:
Oh, yeah, which you've done before, think, haven't you?
LDP:
. . . for a very brief run. But I. . . . What's that?
SM:
You've done it before, haven't you, “Miss Saigon”?
LDP:
Not, not “Miss Saigon.” “The King and I” I have done 600 times. And so I have to say, I don't think I've been as scared. . .
[Laughter]
. . . as I was during the production of that show than I was since “La Bamba.” Because, you know, it was 10 days rehearsal, 10 days performance, and it was a massive role.
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
And I was doing some film work all the way up to the time I was supposed to report for rehearsal. And then I realized how big the mountain I had to climb was. And I did not go out to dinner one time during the rehearsal process because I would rehearse 10 hours a day and then go home and review the soundtrack and study the words. And, it, it was, at my age, it was very daunting, Simon.
[Laughter]
SM:
I, well, I'm not going to ask your age because I've turned blah, 60, blah, this year. Yes.
LDP:
We're, we’re, we’re very close together, my friend.
[Laughter]
SM:
Oh. So I'm, so I'm feeling a little bit odd about it, but it's, it's actually, I'm feeling really kind of, you know, I like the, I like the age of being 60 actually. I really like it.
[Laughter]
LDP:
I'm 62 now. And by the way, you look fantastic.
SM:
Oh, thank you.
LDP:
You look great and you look very healthy. So things are going well, yes?
SM:
Yes, it's going well and after I finish with you I'm going out for a walk and I usually walk about six miles and all of that so I'm doing really, really. . . .
LDP:
That’s fantastic.
SM:
I'm doing really well so thank you.
LDP:
Yeah, good.
SM:
But now after we've talked about this wonderful, and here it is again, “Tinderbox: Underground Movement,” it's a fantastic book and it really is. And I'm going to wait and get the first one and then I'm going to do this one and whether it's in order or kind of not but I'm always gonna do the first one first as it were.
Okay so let's talk last time you were on the podcast. I love this episode I really do and I listen to it a lot. You chose your favorite kind of food films and for our new listeners out there please make sure you check out that episode and so here's a spoiler alert for those people who haven't listened to that.
Skip ahead now for a few seconds if you don't want to hear what films he chose. Give it a break. Okay, so last time you chose “The Godfather,” which was fantastic. Oh. “The Big Night,” which I totally, we both loved that film, which was a film with, oh gosh, what's his. . .
LDP:
Stanley Tucci.
SM:
Yeah, Stanley Tucci who. . .
LDP:
Stanley Tucci and his name when right out of the man. I love him. Oh my gosh, Monk.
SM:
David. . . I know I'm doing the same. Well this is because we're 62. . .
LDP:
Tony Shalhoub. Yeah.
SM:
. . . and we're 62 and 60 so that's what would. . . .
LDP:
Stanley Tucci, Tony Shalhoub, Isabella Rossellini.
SM:
Oh, I mean, just think of that. “Chef,” which you hated, no, you loved and I hated. I still remember that because I. . . .
LDP:
I didn't love it. I didn't love it. We discussed this. I didn't love it. I chose it because it was food-centric and you and I discussed this and felt it was a little, as you say, was one of those situations where I'm gonna give myself a role.
SM:
[Laughter]
Yeah, I mean it's. . . . The, “The Big Hit,” which was one of your own films, I think.
LDP:
Yes.
SM:
Yes, which was great. And, and, and I still haven't seen “Bao” though. So I've got to wait for that.
LDP:
Oh, it's lovely. I think it won, I'm pretty sure it won the Oscar for short animated film that year. And it is so cultural and so beautiful and so universal in a mother's love for her child surrounding this, you know, bao that is an actual character, you know, metaphorically.
SM:
Every time I see that I'm going to... I've never seen it on TV and I, to be honest, with the pandemic and not leaving the house because of my surgery and then just...
LDP:
Yeah.
SM:
I've been so busy, which is great, because the people have been very kind to me.
LDP:
Which is fantastic.
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
It's 12 minutes of your time.
SM:
OK, well, I'll go watch it.
LDP:
Yeah.
SM:
OK, so for this episode, though, I want to hear what favorite food scenes in kind of non food movies you have so, you know. . .
LDP:
Right.
SM:
. . . it could be any film that you wanted. I. . . .You know, things like, what's the one with “When Harry Met Sally” and the food scene in that.
LDP:
I know.
SM:
When they were in, you know, all, all of those things so if you could okay, so we. . .
LDP:
That whole ordering with everything on the side. And then, you know, when she fakes the orgasm, I'll have what she's having.
[Laughter]
SM:
I'll have that.
[Laughter]
So we're gonna do maybe five things what does that sound like to you five? Okay, so let's. . .
LDP:
That sounds like a full course meal.
SM:
[Laughter]
Okay. So let's start with number one. You, you start. I don't even. . . I kind of know what you're going to choose but not all of them.
SM:
So and again, that was great last time because you just told me what they were. So number one, you tell me what that's going to be.
LDP:
Well, since the last time we spoke, this, this series aired, you know. It came on and just fascinated me. And, know, you and I, the restaurants and then, you know, everything. “The Bear.” It's not a movie, but it's a series. And, you know, it's about the restaurant world. And, you know, I mean, this obviously crazy, complicated family that, that, that runs it and all of the, all of the employees and whatnot. It's won God knows how many Emmys, truckloads of Emmys, but, you know, it is so true to life. And the attention to, you could just, you just sit there and it's like “Ratatouille,” you just sit there and watch them put the ingredients together. And it's just, first of all, it's mouthwatering, but it's just gorgeous. But it is, one of the hallmarks of the series is that it is so emotionally fraught. And the chef. . .
SM:
Would you tell people about it?
LDP:
Dale Talde, who's. . . . What's that?
SM:
Will you tell people about it? Because I've not even wanted to watch it. And that's because it's so close to what I do that I just don't want to watch it. So would you mind telling people who are listening to this and don't know what “The Bear” is? And could you tell them, I mean, as much as you can tell them a great. . . the story that they're trying to tell.
LDP:
And like what you said, Chef Dale Talde, a friend to both of us. . .
SM:
Yeah. Yeah.
LDP:
. . . I spoke to him about it. I went to his restaurant, Goose Feathers, here, you know, near New York. He says he watched a few episodes and had to stop. . .
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
. . . because it was too triggering for him.
SM:
That's exactly how I felt. Triggered. That's exactly how I felt.
LDP:
I mean, the high pressure of, yeah, totally triggered, because it's like, you know, memories of him working his way up and whatnot. And it is, it's Jeremy Allen White plays a young man who went to New York to work in, you know, five-star restaurants and that level of intensity and perfection and scrutiny. Had a brother who ran a sandwich shop called The Beef in Chicago. The brother dies by suicide, no secret, goes home to take over the restaurant and transforms the sandwich shop into what he wants to be a Michelin star restaurant. And, and his family is involved. Ayo Edebiri, I hope I pronounced that right. She's wonderful. She is a, a burgeoning chef herself. Eliza Colon-Zayas just won the Emmy in a supporting role. I mean, just a beautiful, beautiful, well executed and they're all only like a half hour long and there's only, you know, 10 episodes per season so it's easily digestible, as it were. It's just that as I said there it's really, really intense but if you were fascinated by, by the restaurant world and a peek behind the scenes as messy and as scary as it is and some unbelievable attention to detail when it comes to the food that's one of them, you know.
SM:
So what I wanted to ask...
LDP:
I would also like to mention. . . .
SM:
Yes, please do.
LDP:
This literally just came to me. They got a first season and now they're going to get a second one for the wine lovers out there. There's a series called drop, “Drops of God.” Did you see that one?
SM:
No, I haven't.
LDP:
Not as intense, but just as beautiful. It's, it’s French, Japanese, English co-production, very global. It is about a, a daughter of a man who has a wine empire and his protege and on his deathbed, he sets up a challenge for the two of them to see who's going to inherit the empire. And they have these wine tests throughout. And it sounds very dry, so to speak, but believe me, it's full bodied. . .
[Laughter]
. . . and a little fruity with a great aftertaste.
SM:
I love, well I love that and you know we talk about “Sideways” and we talk about all those. . .
LDP:
Yeah.
SM:
. . . things and wine is, I don't drink a massive amount now because of my illness but I do drink some of it.
LDP:
Yeah.
SM:
And I make sure I drink the best, you know.
LDP:
Yeah.
SM:
And so whenever I go, that may be one. But what I wanted to ask you because you're obviously watching that because it's such a great series and it's such. . . . For you, it's a great. . . . You could watch it because you're not quite feeling the same that, you know, I feel or someone else's. But I wanted to ask you if you would feel the same about being an actor. So I mentioned there's one I and I love this film. It's called “The Big Picture” and I still remember Martin Short he goes and he's an agent. I still remember this and he meets the Ivy up here and he goes in. . . .
LDP:
Yes!
SM:
Yeah, and he goes, I still remember your, no, he goes, I love this movie. I haven't seen it, but I love it. It's a very. . . . And I still remember. But so, do you as an actor feel the same when you see acting movies like that, which is I get it and they're really fun but do you go, I can't watch that.
LDP:
No, no, I actually love them because it's a little inside baseball and you know, some of the in-jokes. I believe in that same movie it was, oh my God, the actor's name, he's no longer with us, he was amazing, was playing the studio head and the director, Kevin Bacon, wanted to make his movie in black and white and he goes, I don't think they make black and white projectors anymore.
[Laughter]
SM:
[Laughter]
SM:
That is...
LDP:
Love that one. Love, you know, like a “Birdman.” I literally just did a movie that just got picked up. Thank goodness. It's such a weird little film. I didn't know if it would find a distributor, but it did. And it's called Et tu. And I play a director who has mounted a production of Julius Caesar. And I'm slowly losing my mind because I'm pretty sure the young hunk playing Brutus is stooping my wife, who is the production manager. So it's actually a horror film and it gets, it's like “The Shining” meets “Birdman” because it gets a little intense. And Malcolm McDowell is the theater janitor who I turn to for advice an awful lot.
SM:
Oh my gosh, all these people that you meet, I'm so, I'm sure the way you think, because I spend so much time meeting amazing chefs and all these people you meet when you do these, Malcolm McDowell and I just go, he's one of my heroes. I mean, he is just one of the greats.
LDP:
He's a genius and he's an amazing human being who does not suffer fools. So I'm really glad he likes me.
SM:
I just I can't I mean I would love, I would love to go and be you for a while. I would love it. Okay, so that's number one “The Bear.”
LDP:
Yeah.
SM:
So people watching go and watch “The Bear.” I probably won't be watching and won't know anything about it, but go and watch it. Okay, what's number two?
LDP:
Number two was, and I went back and I watched the scene and just realized how brilliant it was. And first of all, the movie is amazing. Roberto Benigni, one best actor for this, but “Life is Beautiful.” Such a life-affirming movie set in the Holocaust. . .
SM:
Yeah.
LDP:
. . . you know, which is ridiculous, but an early scene in the movie is he is a waiter. And he's talking with his doctor who gets easily distracted and the doctor decides not to eat his dinner. Now they've already closed the kitchen, but a man comes in and he wants to, you know, something to eat. So, Roberto Benigni, you know, says, you know, goes to him and says, but for you, for you, we'll do something. What would you like? And he sets him up and the guy says something like this, you know, how about, and then the way he constructs it, he offers him all this heavy, fatty stuff and leads him by the hand to salmon and a salad and a glass of white wine, which is what he already has available.
SM:
Oh.
LDP:
It's brilliant and it's hilarious.
SM:
So tell people again about “Life is Beautiful” because that was I think it won the Oscar the best picture Oscar.
LDP:
I believe it did. I know he won Best Actor.
SM:
Yeah he did. I still remember him walking down to the thing on the top of those chairs all the way down. He was down at the back. I still remember this. I remember him winning.
LDP:
And then he called Hollywood the big nipple. So, you know, obviously, you know, nourishment and how it's delivered is very important to him.
SM:
But tell them about the story because it is, it's a film that's set in the Holocaust and yet it is one of the most kind of meaningful films, I think, because of how he, and I don't think he's ever been as good since. Well, I would say.
LDP:
It was a moment of sheer genius. It really was. And that scene where he's playing the waiter and you see how clever he is, you might just think, okay, that's a funny little aside. I think it pays off throughout the film because it shows how nimble he is and how clever he is, how smart he is, and ultimately caring. He is taken into the prison camp, into a Jewish prison camp by the Nazis with his son. And the whole movie, and this sounds so out there, but it is, it's one of the most heart wrenching and yet life affirming films I've ever seen in that he has to convince his son on a daily basis that this is all make believe and that everybody's just playing. And that everything's gonna be okay. And to keep up this facade of optimism when the audience and he both know how absolutely horrific it is. It's brilliant and it walks that razor's edge, you know, between being comedic and being tragic. It's really beautiful. I can't think of a film that has ever accomplished it quite to that extent.
SM:
No, and I've seen some films like, well, I haven't seen it because Jerry Lewis kept, he did a kind of a similar film about the Holocaust. And when it came out, it was so bad that he actually kept it. He bought it and kept it to himself. I can't remember exactly what the subject of that was, but it was based in a Holocaust, you know, one of these horrible places. And it was just, it didn't work.
So for Roberto Benigni to be able to do that. That is a great one because I think again, if people haven't watched that, I know it's about the Holocaust. I realized that this is a, but this was someone who was really getting to understand it. And afterwards, well, I won't tell you what happens in it because it's for you to watch, but it was a really, really, really great film.
And if you do go on YouTube or something, go and see him when he wins the Oscar and he walks down the chairs. He walks all over the chairs to get to the stage rather than going on the, you know, the aisle or anything. And he's very funny. He's very funny. But this is a tour.